Feedback Feedback needed - DK on the Test Server

Discussion in 'General Archive' started by teddy.bear, Oct 13, 2015.

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  1. teddy.bear

    teddy.bear Forum Ambassador

    To all Dragonknights out there,

    We have introduced the following changes to the class on the test server:​
    • Increased passive rage gain by 40%
    • Moved the Cleanse ability from the 2nd skill talent of “Rage Jump” to the 2nd skill talent of “Dragon Hide”
    • Added a new 2nd skill talent for “Rage Jump”, that will allow you to significantly mitigate damage for a short period of time
    • Removed the rage cost from “Dragon Hide” completely
    • “Charge” now stuns enemies for 3.0 (PvP: 2.0) seconds per default using the “old” stun mechanic (all hit enemies are stunned)
    • Changed the 2nd skill talent of “Charge”. It will now increase the skill damage of “Charge” from 100% to 175%
    • Increased the skill damage of “Rage Attack” from 75% to 100%
    • Increased the radius of the explosion of “Splitting Earth” skill talent from 2.0 to 2.5 meters
    You can log in to the TS now and try them out. Please come back to this thread and drop any piece of feedback that you may have about them!
    Kind regards,
    Your Drakensang Online Team
    Mljax likes this.
  2. morituritesalutamus

    morituritesalutamus Forum Apprentice

    Cleanse for rage jump is every 15s moved to dragon hide its 1 min, why don't you leave cleanse where it is and move the new damage mitigation to dragon hide....
    Celticrain1982, Armando and Walt like this.
  3. Armando

    Armando Forum Connoisseur

    Honestly, I found my DK playable as he was after R155. The improvements (especially passive rage gain) seem nice, but not absolutely necessary.

    BUT, I find it ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE that the cleanse ability was taken from rage jump and moved to dragon hide, for the same reason @morituritesalutamus is mentioning.
    Before, I had every minute 8 seconds of immunity (which I usally activate before going into infight with a difficult opponent like an enchanted miniboss or in PvP) PLUS 6-7 cleanse actions (4-5 times rage jump, 2 times furious battle cry).
    After the change, i will have only one cleanse action with directly following immunity, plus another 2 cleanse actions (FBC) for the following 52 seconds!

    This seems like a devastating loss if you encounter any opponent with a stunning ability whom you can't kill within 10 seconds... Also, in PvE it will mean you have to wait for the cooldown of the dragon hide more often. 8 seconds of fighting, 52 seconds of waiting? Thanks!

    On top of that, MOST of the times, as a 2-h DK, I ACTUALLY do not use the dragon hide for its immunity, but for healing... as I have no other efficient healing skill left (missing the one on the furious battlecry, before R155...), I need to keep the dragon hide for a moment when I have taken a lot of damage and am close to death, in order to fill up my health (almost completely) within a few seconds.
    Thus, I do not want to use it as a cleansing skill when I just got stunned by an opponent and he is only starting to do damage to me!

    Third, if there is one opponent stunning me, he usually has some cooldown on that stunning skill (not talking of chain-lightning mages here...). If I use the dragon hide for cleansing in this moment, its immunity would be wasted.

    So, all in all, I find the combination of the cleansing skill both with the immunity and (even more) with the healing of the dragon hide most unfortunate.

    I have to admit I have no lvl 45 DK on the test server to really test the consequences myself.
    But if it turns out that the effects on PvE (with increasing numbers of enchanted minibosses especially in the PW to be expected soon) are as they look to me, it may happen that I will eventually stop playing my DK, who easily survived R155 so far, because of R157.
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2015
    Celticrain1982 likes this.
  4. Celticrain1982

    Celticrain1982 Forum Apprentice

    I dont have any Dk lvl 50 on test server, but if what -Armando- logically assumes, damage to Dk`s is worst than patch 155 itself. So for God sake just...leave Dk as it was so far.
  5. DebugPlayer

    DebugPlayer Forum Apprentice

    The base problem still not corrected .:confused:

    Comparison with other classes ,
    DK skill still have longest Cool-down time , long delay when start skill , lowest skill power , slow MP restores , and too passive .
    In PvP , DK always passive chase to other classes , lack of easily applicable slows ,
    but RA and SW can easily causes slowed for DK ( Marked and Ice Missile ) ,
    DK very few chance to be close to other classes , and now harder if they use kite tactics .
    Even close to them , other classes have any high power skill can easily kill DK .
    ( RA and SW and SM they all have 300%up crazy damage of long shoot skill , DK ? Highest only 240% short smash . lol )

    And DK skill Cool-down time is very long ,
    for example , we look at some similar effect skill ( and Talent effect ) of all classes :

    Base Cool-down time
    ManaPoints restores value
    Travel speed effect
    Furious battle cry
    30s ( Use Talent : 22s )

    +40 Rage ( Use Talent :+60 )
    +40% for 5s
    20s ( Use Talent : 18s )​
    100% Full​
    +40% for 4s
    ( Use Talent : +60% for 5s )
    (Synchronicity of Singularity : Very Soon)​
    ( Use Talent : 100% Full )​
    10 meter move when use skill.
    ( +25% for 1s of Talent effect )
    • Dwarf is special system , no similar skill .
    Well ...... I don't know Developers how annoying DK ? o_O
    I believe everyone look out what the problem .

    This is my advice modify for DK:
    1. DK must reduction all skill of Cool-down time .
    2. Must change some useless or weak effect talent and skill , such as Battle frenzy .
    3. Must increase DK all skill power , and please give a 300%up of one hit skill ( for Smash or Mighty wild swing ).
    4. Reduction skill start delay , DK's action has been slow to can easily ducked .
    5. Give DK a higher mobility design or better travel speed, for better against long-range attack .

    DK looks like a tortoise now , we are hoping to big change .:confused:

    Moved the Cleanse ability from the 2nd skill talent of “Rage Jump” to the 2nd skill talent of “Dragon Hide”
    DK of two Cleanse ability skill Cool-down time is 30s ( Furious battle cry ) & 60s ( Dragon Hide )
    RA : 12s ( Dive ) & 20s ( Adrenaline )
    SW : 10s ( Teleport ) & 20s ( Frost Nova )
    SM : 10s , or cost MP no Cool-down time ( Rocket Pack )

    Hm.....What should I say?
    Congratulations again DK is the longest Cool-down time champion ?:confused:

    Removed the rage cost from “Dragon Hide” completely
    but 3rd talent “All negative effects” is fake all negative effects ,
    now many debuff effects still can't resist , please fix .

    Increased the skill damage of “Rage Attack” from 75% to 100%
    Rageful swing please back old build rage and increase damage, too.;)

    “Charge” now stuns enemies for 3.0 (PvP: 2.0) seconds per default using the “old” stun mechanic (all hit enemies are stunned)
    Changed the 2nd skill talent of “Charge”. It will now increase the skill damage of “Charge” from 100% to 175%

    Is good again , old Charge back :), but Charge cost 30 rage need reduction to 20 rage .
    Because Smash only use 20 rage can 200% damage , so Charge not worth cost 30 rage for 100% ( or 175% ) damage .
    And must change new talent for 1st and 3rd , they are really useless .

    Increased the radius of the explosion of “Splitting Earth” skill talent from 2.0 to 2.5 meters
    In fact , now Ground breaker is very long delay start , very small radius straight line , and very slow fly .
    This change still does not make sense , unless the enemy lazy move in PvP or PvE .:D

    BTW , I don't speak English .
    If have problem , please don't mind grammar .:p
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2015
  6. Krazydamage

    Krazydamage Forum Apprentice

    Level 47 DK now.
    These changes wont affect anything in a meaningful way.

    The problem is that the melee class has the same damage and survival as the ranged classes
    Look at any other game, the ranged always has less damage and less survival.

    So the question is, why bother to play melee when its more risky and harder and you don't get rewarded with meaningful Damage or Tankiness.

    Specific examples:

    Look at PVE lvl 45 to 50 quests, every single annoying mob is a problem only for DK and other classes don't even get bothered by it.
    1. Orbax spits acid directly underneath him, DK cannot stand in it. RA/SW don't care
    2. Toltac shamans can run faster BACKWARDS than an Olympic sprinter.
    As a DK you want to tear your hair out to get to even 1 of these guys, nevermind if there are 2 or 3 at the same time.
    3. All "Protectors" (fire/water/ice/life/death) heavily punish melee as they have 2 melee only attacks and a ranged attack which is laughably easy to dodge.
    And I want to note here that I can solo these guys easily with just a technique of attack, back up to dodge attack again, dodge etc. its basically 1 attack then dodge, but this is painfully slow and, again I ask myself WHY PLAY MELEE when I could just RA /SW these guys easily.

    4. Almost every single mob in the game can be kited/tricked or there is a safe "perch" spot
    E.g. The skeleton archer in Q1 u can fire at him through the 1/2 pillar. Anyone except DK can exploit
    The broken bridge that everyone jumps in M2, SW/RA can kill whatever is on the other side before jumping across, same thing for the ledge in M1.

    Don't even get me started on this.
    The only way I can think of that a DK could even be viable is with a huge bonus to damage and survival vs RA/SW.
    At the moment they only get 10% More Armor and 10% more HP FROM ITEMS only according to patch notes R156.
    They don't even get extra resistance.
    I think this would have to be increased A LOT like +30% HP +30% armor and +30% resistance to even begin to make DK viable.

    As it stands now, a DK can't even ever hit a RA or SW for the reasons mentioned above that both RA and SW have lower cooldown stun break + jump away skills.
    All the RA / SW has to do is spam basic attacks or anything else at you from 2 screens away. To even have any hope of getting close you have to run around in a circle Mounted and pray to not get hit until you get 1 screen away so that you can Charge/Rage jump.
    The ONLY way to get on top of someone as DK is to use either charge (charge requires you to build rage first) or rage jump. It's easily countered by SW or RA using the freeze / net stun and then stun break + jump away, and then u are dead because you have 0 rage to do anything more. Some smart SW will even cast singularity on top of themselves.

    Also, has anyone ever tried to hit an enemy on MOUNT using DK? its nearly impossible.
    Literally if an enemy is mounted you cannot even fight him.
    Conversely, if you are a RA or SW all you have to do is spam basic attack and you can hit mounted enemies.
    Mljax and Celticrain1982 like this.
  7. hempthegreen

    hempthegreen Advanced

    Wait until you get to Balor you will really want to rip your hair out lol.

    Before r155 DKs were one of the best classes, once r155 came the DKs game life quickly hit rock bottom. However they are not dead or useless. You do have interesting points ... Next release i think they will be adding to trhe defensive side for the DK .. I do know they will be brining back the rage build that was so important to have.

    AS far as pvp goes it all comes down to skill. If you have played 5000+ matches (like myself) The skill comes along. You will notice alot of classes play the same or close to it. You can time your attacks or rage jumps to where they are headed or you think they will be headed. I know for sure ive hit players on mounts in 5v5 just today in fact. All i did was time my ground breaker to their path and BAM! got em!!

    I will say in duels The DK has it the worst. All other classes can shoot through the barriers but the nice solid barrel at the north end of the ring. they play dirty you can do it to will take sometimes a full match but it works ;)

    Dont get me wrong. There is Very good players out there that will fight with skill and not hide... And win to!
  8. _Baragain_

    _Baragain_ Living Forum Legend

    2H DKs have it the worst... the 1H DKs with uber HP and defense can still exhaust their SW, SM, and RA opponents if they just run and run and run and make sure to chip away their opponents hp over the two min.
    Shiladitya likes this.
  9. Zamvel7

    Zamvel7 Active Author


    first of all good afternoon or morning i dont know,

    I dont see any boost to the DK's dmg, now for a long period players after the R155 suggested more dmg or more crit, a boost of maybe 30% for the melee class would be awesome, now i know 1h are not meant to be dps they are maybe 30% would not be the best way, perhaps just 20% on 1h and 30% of more total dmg on 2h mode.

    I dont play on pvp but changing the Cleanse ability from the jump from a point of view is a step back, DK's are always at front and they get stunned more often, meaning we need 2 Cleanse abilities which can be casted in between with a short interval.

    Also i think i read it here, but since DK are always the meatballs we need to more rage (good upgrade there) but also our skills need to have a shorter cooldown...

    which reminds me, our taunt skill needs to last longer, i know many players hate it, because let's be honest on pvp is useless, but against bosses it's the perfect match, buuuut it needs to last longer

  10. Shiladitya

    Shiladitya Padavan

    Totally worth 5 points.
  11. silverseas

    silverseas Count Count

    Oi oi, 2.5m explosion radius means it's larger than a fireball explosion radius, and the same size as Frozen Sphere explosion. Just to give you some perspective. I know people complain about the SW skill explosion radiuses. Radii. Whatever.
    Armando likes this.
  12. BigPapa

    BigPapa Forum Overlooker

    Great, DK's will be able to stun flag runners easier hoping others are around to do the killing since their damage is insufficient to do so. Unless of course the flagrunner gets a stun off first in which case the DK will watch the flagrunner pass by, turn in the flag, and return for another run before their cooldown resets. (yes I know, exageration). Alot of work in alot of wrong places in this "rebalance". You didnt fix the problems DK's are facing with these updates.
  13. bonjourvietnam

    bonjourvietnam Someday Author

    Well, thanks for making some changes.
    1. Increased passive rage gain: Good, in PvP and PvE.
    2. and 3. and 4. It just gives back what we had before R155 and you guys know what? Other classes got a huge boost, but we just get what used to be ours.
    5. and 6. and 7. and 8. What makes a melee class? That's the ability to catch the enemies OR the ability to survive when getting hit by enemies. It's only Charge that can help us catch the enemies. And Ground Breaker? NO! When we stun them and try to get close to them, they already gone far far away.
    Dragon Hide (cooldown 1min) and Rage Jump really don't help much because when these skill are in charge, we die by getting the massive damage from range class.
    8. Well, it's just another choice for us, enemies can easily avoid the skill but it's still ok.
    Totally, I appreciate every change to rebalance DKs and PvP but these change still not focus on the core problem. I hope some useful change will be made in further release.
    Mljax likes this.
  14. morituritesalutamus

    morituritesalutamus Forum Apprentice

    The adjustment for armor on DK vs. the other range classes was laughable, have you considered bumping that up ?
  15. wangwang

    wangwang Active Author

    make it 90% block reachable for DK
  16. Shiladitya

    Shiladitya Padavan

    I understand your pain regarding the fire damage :p but fireball and ice sphere explode on contact , ground breaker at the exact point of discharge. I agree its an improvement from the prev 2 m by .5 m. would i spend 5 skill points to use it after its awesome improvement? no, what would i have used for 5 points? explosion at point of contact with smaller radius. what would i give to use the new balanced ground breaker, ideally 2 points, max 3.
    Mljax likes this.
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