Dailybuild_1071 & 1076

Preach it.

Dont assume stuff cause you can be gravely mistaken.
This is when I started playing and Im playing actively since then.



I probably know more about this game than you can forget.

Is this really coming out of another SWs mouth? Big yikes.

Magma shield cooldown is unit-unique aka cooldown is applied on unit recieving the magma shield buff not meteor itself.
Each guardian is unique so casting guardian - meteor - guardian - meteor will result in both guardians having magma shield.

 

Still would u prefer a 100% mana restored to boost your team Dps or your Guardian to tank 3 seconds longer?
I dont bother using magma shield , never expirimented with it, so there si no way for me to know .
Idk to make the Sw a support will be kinda strange. While u cast 3 spells to keep the agro im sure u wont have enought time to atack. So what u suggest is to make Sw take Dks place , which can work for a weaker Sw ,it can be a valid option. But if its widely used it will be nerfed due to still making 1h Dks useless

 

no 3 more seconds, but 3+3+3... in summary, infinite.

When you can recover full mana with few attacks, you trying to compare it with a set... is ridiculous... my only way to spam is having q7 set while you spam by simply being a mage :/ Again you need to understand the difference between a class and a set, which class is op by definition (mage) and what's a crap class set dependant with the lowest time on buff
In fact, that crap gearless PvP shows the evidence and it's up to all see the huge differences and unbalances between classes, it's so obvious I don't need to answer your lies and selfdefenses for fear of a fix (you will call it nerf).

Btw are you obviating again that MC is buged and you use 2 infinite singus at same time?

 

This was my suggestion in a facebook dso group created by the devs from bigpoint called Players panel.

note: the post was very simplified.

Except minor number changes (monster health for example), I would keep the current dificulties as they are right now as stated above and add the raid difficulty.

This is obviously a problem. There is absolutely no reason to implenet my idea unless items/mounts or honestly anything of value is added, that can only be obtained in the raid dificulty.

Main thing for these raids would have to be CV requirement to enter, which creates additional problems:
1) Another feature regarding raid queueing would have to be added
2) How can you tell someone actually has the CV required and not just items with the maximum CV the person can get to fit in?
3) are the devs even willing to take on such a big project?

And as I continue my list of all things that need to be done and thought about for raids to work properly, the game basicaly becomes WoW and thats exactly what can't happen.
Thats why I didn't give my opinion, because its unrealistic and prioritizes on what i would like to be done rather than what I would to with the patch on ts.

tldr; my whole idea is to split current live servers difficulty and test server difficulty into two.

 

@MaxDisappointed

Nope, sorry. SWs are spamming spheres cause they opt in for 2 (flat and scaling) mana buffs and mana pots which both mages and rangers can use.
( 100 base resources + 100 from tonic + 20 from wisdom + 20 from runes ) * 1.24 = 300 resources

Include glove runes and you get 10% resource costs reduction (from 66 to 59 [EA] and from 50 to 45 [FS])

So now let's talk abilities: (SOLO)

RANGER

300/59 = 5

5 EAs
Net
7 EAs (q7)
Adrenaline
5 EAs
Resource pot (+240 conc)
5 EAs (+60 conc from pot rot [resources over time])
3s break (+120 conc from pot rot)
Net
7 EAs (q7) (+90 conc from pot rot)
4 EA
Adrenaline
5 EAs

Total combo duration: 19s
Total EA count: 38
Total damage (before mitigation): (14*500%*1,6) + 24*500% = 23200% // 14 EAs (500) q7 empowered (1.6) , 24 normal EAs
Total damage (mitigation included): 23200%*0,5 (on average) = 11600%
Total dps: 11600%/19s = 610,5% dps

MIND YOU - THIS IS WITHOUT ANY NET RESET!

SPELLWEAVER

300/45 = 6

8 FSs
Singu under yourself
Teleport
8 FSs
Resource pot (+240 mana)
10 FSs (+90 mana from pot rot)
Teleport
11 FSs (+120 mana from pot rot)
3s break (+90 mana from pot rot)
6 FSs

Total combo duration: 19s
Total FS count: 43
Total damage (before mitigation): 43*410% = 17630%
Total damage (mitigation included): 17630%*0,5 (on average) = 8815%
Total dps: 8815%/19s = 464% dps

MIND YOU - THIS IS WITHOUT MIND CONTROL SINCE "TRUTH-WARRIORS" SAY IT'S A BUG AND SHOULDN'T WORK THAT WAY!

610,5% ranger dps in comparison to 464% spellweaver dps.
610,5% not including net resets
464% not including singularity resistance reduction (since without mind control you cant singu both boss and yourself)

Single net reset is equal to 7 EAs aka 5600% unmitigated/2300% mitigated damage over 2s

let's include q7 weapon 'switching' for spellweavers (ignoring how tedious and hard it is to keep track of cooldowns, maintain singu under yourself, switching weapons AND dpsing at the same time) and we get:

464%*1,6 = 742,5% dps if EVERY SINGLE SPHERE WILL BE Q7 BUFFED
742,5% spellweavers dps in comparison to 610,5% ranger dps

And you DARE to speak of "spellweaver superiority" and "singu cdr and astral phenomenon" as bugs?
Mage can have A BIT HIGHER dps (22%) only if they constanly switch weapons, maintain q7 buff, cast and maintain singu on themeselves (valid only on bosses that stand still) meanwhile you're doing 82% of that dps while drooling on your keyboard and using EA, Adrenaline and Net.

BuT mUh BalAnCe, FiX tHeSe SpAmMiNg MaGeS!

 

You need to add all possible buffs+maxed runes+maxed allyoucouldfound on ranger to do this "calculations" and saying you will not count MC because it is a bug (a bug that is working? ), only this way you want to point that... ranger is superior to mage? HAHAHAHA Seriously?
Just stop, pls. We all know the truth. Take a look in Swerdfield, you'll always see a mage doing fireball spam (infinite fireball spam, no buff or set needed btw) to try kill blindly without any skill or use of the brain, so funny.

 

You forgot 27-33,3% mana from items for mage

@MaxDissapointed
These are the numbers for the next patch tho?
And the numbers dont lie, if the conditions are recreated ranger will have more damage

 

We are not in this patch, that calculations are not real yet, maybe never will, you can't point something on 'guesses' or 'maybes'.
The reality and the fact is mage is superior and not balanced.

 

@RakshaRanja
mind doing the live server calculations?
I'm pretty sure they're still higher

 

After doing the calc , a ranger with max cd runes has almost q7 permanent( 2 second acive time while the net has 4 sec cooldown without counting any resets.)..... so... ye ... balance, i know u search for it , i do too.

And since they said they will be fixing astral phenomenon ( your favourite ability to spam on the forum) , how can i have singu under me and the boss mr. bug ?

@MaxDisappointed why do u go to swirfield if u claim that the onehit ko is broken ?
Why do u compare mana items with every ranger that runs either q8 or karabossa , but u want the same ability spam.
Make a build with q1 armor , with khalys pauldrons , with good reduction runes and cooldown ones , and im sure you will sing a new song

idk man what realty u speak of . but u want to have the character not baased around q7 . but at the same time we dont have broken q7 soooooo u want to have a class that is strong by default and then overbreak it with a set... just go play a dwarf then.... i mean thats what u want.
And just to put in u in a perspective ... if i give u to play my mage to perform the bugs you spam everywhere .. you wont kill grimag on inf 3 in less than 2 minutes, because u dont know how much attention it takes to order your skills , but from what u said " EA takes so much more to aim than ice sphere" and this is where i understood u have no idea what u are speaking of.

 

Supposedly it should be fixed months ago, why should I believe that this time is definitive when it should have been before? If being a crybaby works to get the bug again, but you are mad if someone else (no mage) point facts on forum.
Let's wait to see what happens, better not talk before time, then they revert the bugfixes, you know them, don't you, mr. mage (aka mr. bug)?

Again just talking about sets, you also have permanent q7, 9 sec buff, 10 cd on meteor when you stay on singu, wow! The difference I already told you, is you don't need q7 to be efficient, you have it all just for being a mage, less cd, less resource cost, resource regen, more base damage on skills, you can do FS spam without needing to throw nets :O You can do fireball spam in PvP without needing a set, even being gearless xD permaguardian, perma breaking armor, perma damage increased by singu + perma damage increased by set
But do more bad calcs obviating what you want to get the numbers you want.
What runes do you use on gloves, btw?

 

no u cant do fireball spam in pvp , swirfield is NOT pvp , thus that point u make doesnt count.
Less cost for less dmg,
More base damage ? Repeat ? 500 is more than 360 hmmm i see this ends the conversation to me @etnave this man is a lost cause

 

I have a mage, I played it in PvP, is considerably easier to kill players than with a ranger.
Swerdfield is a map where mages can show their potential and also their mediocrity as mages, it's all reduced to: "I have it all, I will spam you till the end of the world with my hugest skill and larger range while you try to aim 1 EA."
Because, you know, spam is by default on mages. Set and skill dependant on rangers.
500 physical and 360 ice? You never say that my basic shot is 66% while yours is 100%. That you can shoot more FS than I can do with EA. No calculations for all of this?

 

The thing is you have to open your inventory, equip both q7 parts, use meteor, equip your normal items and continue all while keeping your singu permanenet while also trying to use your teleport of cooldown while also trying to shoot as many FS as possible.
saying mages have q7 for 9s = it's permanent just isn't true.
Most of the time it's not even worth using it while the boss is alive, if you can't do it under a second, because you just lose more damage than you gain from it.
Trust me mages really aren't a single button class.
I have been constantly able to reach 260 actions per minute on bosses and even more on maps. Thats 4.33 buttons/click per second. While standing still.

The cost of fireball is equal to the cost of precision shot

once again, you either use it on yourself or on the boss and "tank" it. No in between. If you do double singu ur dmg is just nonexistent on bosses

I mean this always happens what a mage defends himself in any way. People can't accept the fact that mages play around one spell with their other spell, unlike the rest of the classes which makes mage a "one spell" class for a lot of people.

 

People are focusing only on bosses ... but no one is talking about their minions.
Those minions are hitting harder than the boss ... just one example: Mortis'knights are hitting harder than Mortis and having a huge def. on top of it ... plus providing stacking buffs.

I agree with you on bosses and changes and all that ... but I disagree with this one.
That number is "utopian" providing the ranger will never miss ... which is impossible ... on top of it as I said in my previous posts rangers skills are bugged (including EA) and not hitting the target ... so those numbers are not relevant ATM.
While SW's FS even if miss (which will not happen) the explosion will almost certainly hit ... if EA miss (most probably) there is no explosion at all.
And again ... I am not getting into class vs class fights ... just asking the devs to fix Ranger's skills ... then ban all the cheaters ... then we can see what needs to be balanced.
I don't care if another class clears the map or kills the boss 6 hours faster than me ... but when having a clear advantage in PvP ... just because of bugs, exploits and cheats ... is not acceptable.

------Merged------

What is there to be accepted?
Other classes don't have spells ... only magician has spells.

 

Mortis knight alrady hit harder than hit, im used to their shenanigans.
Traki the hits missed depend on the boss.
I miss on Heredur , u do on Arachna , and everybody does on Bearach. But since Ea is in line even if the boss dashes if ea is near their new destination ( example heredur teleport) when he teleports right in frint of u you wont loose ea shot because they will hit him , but Fs wont , fireball behaves the same way.
So if i miss , you will miss we cant take miss into consideration, because it adds the random factor, and if we start accounting randomness we might never ever get to a conclusion.

 

Nope ... I am not talking about that one.
Ranger's skills especially EA miss even on stationary targets ... even in PvP.
It doesn't have to be a boss.

I am talking R220 ... play on TS you will see how much they are buffed up

 

I did not forget. Not every mage is using q1 torso.
If we're counting q1 on mage so do we on ranger (EA cost 60 --> 50) or a8 set (lower adrenaline cd).

Live rotation would look somewhat like this:

7 FSs (-1 FS)
Singu under yourself
MC
Teleport
8 FSs
Teleport
8 FSs
Resource pot (+240 mana)
10 FSs (+90 mana from pot rot)
2s break
Singu under yourself
MC
Teleport
10 FSs (+90 mana from pot rot)
Teleport
10 FSs (+60 mana from pot rot)

Total combo duration: 21s
Total FS count: 53
Total damage (before mitigation): 53*410% = 21730%
Total damage (mitigation included): 21730%*0,5 (on average) = 10865%
Total dps: 10865%/21s = 517% dps

But now including ranger's net reset:

5 EAs
Net (reset)
7 EAs (q7)
Net
7 EAs (q7)
Adrenaline
5 EAs
Resource pot (+240 conc)
5 EAs (+60 conc from pot rot [resources over time])
3s break (+120 conc from pot rot)
Net
7 EAs (q7) (+90 conc from pot rot)
4 EA
Adrenaline
5 EAs

Total combo duration: 21s
Total EA count: 45
Total damage (before mitigation): (21*500%*1,6) + 24*500% = 28800% // 21 EAs (500) q7 empowered (1.6) , 24 normal EAs
Total damage (mitigation included): 28800%*0,5 (on average) = 14400%
Total dps: 14400%/21s = 686% dps

(6x without reset + 4x with reset) / 10
(6*610,5 + 4*686%) / 10 = 641%

Still 641% (RA) > 517% (SW).

Let's also take into consideration that mana buffs dont work on bosses on dailybuild so mages are quite literally crippled from majority of their damage.

( 100 base resources + 20 from wisdom + 20 from runes ) * 1.24 = 140 resources

2 FSs
Singu under yourself
MC
Teleport
3 FSs
Teleport
3 FSs
Resource pot (+112 mana)
2 FSs (+14 mana from pot rot)
3s - spam with magic missile (4x MM per sec [12 in total] - about 46 mana/s with magic missile, rot and natural resource regen)
2 FSs
Singu under yourself
MC
Teleport
3 FSs
Teleport
3 FSs
4s - spam with magic missile (4x MM per sec [16 in total] - about 32 mana/s with magic missile and natural resource regen)
3 FSs

Total combo duration: 20s
Total FS count: 21
Total MM count: 28
Total damage (before mitigation): 21*410% + 28*116% = 11858%
Total damage (mitigation included): 11858%*0,5 (on average) = 5929%
Total dps: 5929%/20s = 296,5% dps

Meanwhile rangers wont suffer that much due to spamability of their q7 (resets) and how much dps it brings - guaranteed 2300% mitigated / 5600% unmitigated damage in 2s per 10s (7s with max cdr runes) with 40% chance to reset on hit.

Im sorry what? Did you even read what I wrote? Or youre ignoring arguments again?

Both classes with 300 resources, their natural resource regeneration, 10% cost reduction from runes. What "all possible buffs" mean when both classes have the same buffs aka 2x resource buff, "maxed runes" when Im taking 3+3+2+2 into consideration so pretty average. What even "allyoucouldfound" is supposed to mean? Lack of argument much?

Q7 is broken. Without mana buffs (and buffs ARE DISABLED ON BOSSES ON TEST SERVER) mages would deal fraction of what they do now.

Obviously this is perfect case scenario or "with tank" of some sorts. But so is SWs.
Not a single ranger I know ever said a thing about "vanishing" damage from EAs. Mind sharing any proof for it being "such a big bug" that I have to take it into consideration when couting dps? I cant imagine it happening so often that it makes a difference in these calculations.

It's not about "class fights". It's about absurdity of "fix mages" statement. SWs already suffer from lack of dps. Either MC gotta be "reverted" to its previous state or singu stays as it is. Without either one SWs would deal about half damage of DKs/RAs and 1/4 of SMs.

Im cool with taking away the "singu fix", trust me. But reverting MC to its previous state is necessary for "singu fix" to go. Doing that would raise SWs skill cap since you'd have to MC+singu to have it permanently like we had to before and majority of SWs are fine with that, really.

 

Ok guys, I think we're missing the point of this new update. While some of you are still debating which class is superior (Mage: PvP, Ranger: PvE for sure) or whom can spam more, which is Ranger class (sadly, Rangers only know Witch Seeker set, which gives them max damage for showing cool stats, but poorly performance on practice).

The thing is: Monsters and bosses health/damage are getting increased which leads to a slow farming > more time wasted for getting the same drop > less items looted than before > less gold incoming per hour > less crafting than before > worst equipment for people who haven't finished their toons yet > more deaths > more resources wasted and still same prices on items.

I think as players, we should be focusing on ask for items' selling prince be increased as well, as for at least 2x or 3x their actual price or reduce the crafting price. But, actually who cares, since it's DSO Dev Team we're talking about.

P.S.: Wanna know how powerful is a true spamming Ranger? Not that generic Witch Seeker + Q7, but with Q7 + Resources reduction items + Runes. At the moment I have Concentration costs reduced by 38% but easily after next DtU event I'll have 40% on 2H, which leads to a EA concentration cost of 39.6

With both pots, and 5 Solstice stars, I can reach 303 concentration.

(100+25+20+100)*1.24 = 303/39.6 = 8 EA
Now sum all that previous calcs for Q7 done before. Seriously guys, stop this 'who can spam more' thing.

 

And yet, you have people like Arr who's all hands on deck about upcoming update ignoring completely the fact that they will farm much slower and will be paper on higher difficulties.

DSO community at its finest.

Yeah. But I think adding new difficulty would be much better. Like etenave said.

We should be able to farm items at the rate we currently are since they recently "rebalanced" economy which they will screw over with that patch.

New difficulty above Inf 4 (not Inf5) should be added instead of messing with entire balance of income, "economy", crafting - this is simply a bad move.

Difficulties should stay as they are and we should be able to toggle between Infernal and "Raid" or something.

See, youre missing the point but Im not surprised. He's doing everything to nimbly dodge the arguments and make as much havoc as possible.

This isnt about which class can spam more. This is about complete absurdity of "fix mages" movement aka fix astral phenomenon so it works only when mob is "controlled" and remove cdr from singu on singu itself.

Spellweavers without one of these will cease to exist. They are balanced around having low cooldowns.

And that's what this is about.