dragan set - weapon damage increased

Discussion in 'General Archive' started by Arr, Jul 3, 2018.

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  1. Phyrix

    Phyrix Count Count

    if you look at game xx and game xxx then actually these 2h weapons is quite feasible with their dmg to speed ratio
     
  2. Akageshi

    Akageshi Forum Duke

    I understand that you don't like the idea of losing the devastating power, both in damage and speed of 2h weapons.
    But at the same time, 2h and 1h, to actually be a thing, they need to have unique attributes that benefit both builds in one way and take something away from them in another way. In DSO, it can be speed for damage, damage for critical, resource cost for damage, etc.

    In case that 2h can have it all except for blocking, the only 1h that makes sense is a 1h + shield. But does it really work for DPS classes to have 1h + shield? Maybe in pvp. They survive better but their main purpose of DPS is defeated. And a 1h + book/quiver kind of setup would become pointless, for 2h does the exact same thing, and better.

    So perhaps, the result here is that we have only 2 possible setups for all classes: 2h or defensive 1h + shield. 2h has damage, speed, critical; 1h has blocking + something that doesn't make you totally laughable in terms of actual damage. Quivers and whatnot will be removed.
    Not really sure about this, though. a game needs some complexity to it. Reducing build types may be a step in a wrong direction. In fact, it happens in DSO currently, as 2h has become almost a must for DPS classes...
     
  3. Phyrix

    Phyrix Count Count

    An option would have been dual wielding
    But this game does not have the animations for it
     
  4. _Baragain_

    _Baragain_ Living Forum Legend

    You sure about that?
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    It seems they made the animations for a dual wielding like caster which was later replaced by the SW class before the closed beta release. And recognize the boss in the last image? It took them about six years before they finally implemented him in the game... We've been told many times that the next class will be melee, so here's hoping.
     
  5. Phyrix

    Phyrix Count Count

    Awesome!!!
    I am no veteran of the game though, however when I say dual wielding I do mean the ability to hit with each weapon at a time.
    Not both at the same time as that would be well using it in the same way as a 2h weapon.
    but imagine smashing with 2 hands individually, same with mages and chain lightning for example.
    However some skills would not accompany this.
    Lightning strike for mages
    Anyways this opens so many many offensive options
    Imagine using cube weapon in main hand and a 3rd twin queen piece in the other
    or for that matter 2 cube weapons.
    This is my preferred fighting style in 3 other isometric arpgs.
    As for the image it looks like Asar wearing a death helm.
    How would damage be calculated though, the same as a 2h user?
    Basically one would reach 40k damage no problem (actually 42k will be max)
    A build like this would leave Q7 in the dust even.
    I would have loved to have this ability for all current classes, not a new class.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  6. trakilaki

    trakilaki Living Forum Legend

    Yes ... that is what I said
    BTW ... Longbows never had damage of a 2H (I read it somewhere I can't find it now) https://drakensangonline.wikia.com/wiki/The_Herald's_Burning_Thunder

    You don't need it ... because you already have it from the start.
    - SWs have high mana regeneration + skills that are filling the mana very fast. They don't need mana reduction on one type of weapon when they already have it with all types of weapons , sets and items.
    - DKs don't need it too because they are getting rage fast + they have many useful skills that are giving them back their rage fast (ask Baragain if he is using peridots at all).
    - SMs already have it ... they can use it with both shortbow-like and longbow-like weapons ... their offensive offhand is having steam regeneration per second.
    No!
    Everyone should be given option ... so everyone should play their game as they like.
    I am not against 2Hs ... I am just saying the other players should be given equal option too.
    1 day if P2W
    more than 6 years if F2P
    I am playing 6+ years and I am still not full royal. I am almost full royal ... with few more Amethysts and Diamonds to craft while having Royal Rubies and Cyanites twice as much I need.
    Now ... you are making wrong assumption. It is not the 2H that are making you farm faster ... it is the certain 2Hs with broken buffs.
    All the other 2H are on par with 1H ... I can even outperform 2Hs with my crappy 1H + quiver with no buffs and bonuses (having in mind all the runes and gems I am having) ... but that is only compared to ordinary 2Hs. Those 2Hs with broken buffs are untouchable for the rest of 2Hs and 1Hs.
    Even with them you can speed it up a bit ... but in reality only cheaters are making difference. You can't be "no lifer" for years so you can fast farm 24/7 all the time ... but gangbangers are no "no lifers" they play one toon for a short time but they are 2-3-10 people playing same toon and having huge advantage over all.
     
    _Baragain_ likes this.
  7. _Baragain_

    _Baragain_ Living Forum Legend

    Why would I waste slots that could go towards HP runes for resource cost reduction? As a DK, I'm getting hit multiple times a second and my HP gets converted in to Rage at a highly efficient rate. The only "expensive" skills are MWS, Fury of the Dragon, and Outburst. Two of those recover more HP than is lost to receive that much rage (Outburst and MWS) while Fury of the Dragon is a DoT skill that only needs to be used every 4 seconds, giving it an effective cost of 15 rage per second of use (which is actually really low and insignificant when compared to the rage received from getting damaged).
     
  8. Arr

    Arr Forum Expert

    to me discussion is not about 1 hand weapons vs 2 hand weapons but is about our weapon choices, right now we can effectively use only 1 (herald) so that dragan bonus could enhance other weapons and help to change this monotony in where everyone uses the same weapon, same attack, same play style...

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    you can see that 90% of weapons are useless and for an rpg thats a big failure
     
  9. Phyrix

    Phyrix Count Count

    Is Q7 really "that" powerful?
    Let us take a look at your weapon choices, first I will be targeting the 2 hand weapons in the list that I know.
    Bearach weapon:
    Yes the set bonus is kinda corny but the bleed is pretty damn powerful.
    What many players forget is that scatter shot now breaks armor so that bleed is damage is increased
    Now players argue yeah but that is only 50% it is more like 70% with the armor break
    And isnt 70% = to your main attack? But that is dealt to a horde and with 1 shot so now its that 70% x 4 seconds to a mass of enemies
    All this while you can still use explosive arrow, precise shot etc at your own free will without having to do anything like jump through hoops for the Q7 buff
    Max damage attainable on it for a ranger = 37000

    Blood rune weapon:

    See there the description is wrong
    It is supposed to read 100% increased weapon damage as long as your hp stays above 33%
    That works like dragans' rageful armor weapon damage.
    But not only that, the max damage you can reach with that weapon is 38k
    Now its that damage at much higher speed than any other weapon.

    Royal safety net bow:
    What the hell why is it in here?
    Well lets say you are a noob
    A total and absolute noob with no crafting ability
    It is the only weapon that can get you close to 30k damage uncrafted
    It also has built in 6% attack speed so that is like a bonus rune
    I am also bearing witness to my ranger friend whom does not drop gold lines
    Heck he doesnt drop weapons often either
    Thats sad because he wants to give the bear weapon a go but has no craft for it yet (and it has been a better part of 5 months now)
    In the meantime though he has nearly 27k damage and his helm is not even crafted yet.

    over to 1h weapons

    Wow
    Just wow
    Makes me envy rangers
    Did you look at the gwenfara bow?
    That base damage is insane on t6 lvl 55 the base can be 504-588 <- this is on level 55 (craft that baby with 204% idoti)
    Damn, that is huge for 1h and of course you get the 25% increased damage and i guess you can use the quiver too
    I never knew
    Bugger the rest of the 1h items
    Why dont dks have that and we get a crappy axe?
     
  10. sargon234

    sargon234 Commander of the Forum

    They don't have to be identical to the longbow of rangers, they should be similar, but not the same, so the resource reduction cost would not be there

    A sort of midway between the slow 2weapon and the fast 1h weapon

    it's for increasing diversity, since they actually have given 2h options for rangers
     
  11. Arr

    Arr Forum Expert

    compared to herald bow, any other one takes you twice as long to kill a boss
     
  12. Phyrix

    Phyrix Count Count

    Nope.
    That is an illusion set by play style literally. (this is regarding dks at least)
    Before using the Q4 set I saw a video. (this was pre r209)
    Anyways there is this Russian player and he used the following method.
    Rageful swing iron brow and charge.
    It took him a good 5 to 7 minutes to take down medusa in the said video.
    Thats a horrible time for someone as strong as he was. (which is probably why he ended up turning to Q7)
    However I play with Q7 dks sometimes, and have adopted their play style with a twist.
    I use rage attack and smash in my mouse buttons but have rageful swing and bloody wild swing assigned to nr1 and nr 2 (when in map I swop rage attack and rageful swing)
    Now if you want to know what is OP we are busy working on the following.
    A guild mate of mine has the premium weapon for his ranger and got it for his mec recently, till he has a craft.
    Anyways he does not play with his mec often, however with heavy shot being cooled down by 50% and using some cooldown runes and group skills we are pushing for him to be able to use heavy shot every second
    This enables him to do 270% base damage (without the triple shot) every second.
    While doing this he is still able to do his machine gun turret and all his other skills.
    We actually discussed him using the sigris set too. ( which will give him triple shots with mechanical turret)
    Wow so you say Q7 is powerful?
    As for my dk I am using 3 darkness pieces.
    With this I am pushing to use 39% damage in helm, belt, and in torso (eventually) and 15% set bonus from 3 darkness pieces.
    While being able to have 399% critical damage and 2.72 attacks per second with 25k crit and this at 36-7k damage.
    It takes a lot to beat Q7
    Now for any ranger using the same setup as I do with Q4, it is also true that EA breaks a huge amount of armor.
    So now you are facing a boss, you EA him then scatter shot him and then use even something like hunting arrow.
    I thinks that is total armor break and then he will bleed a huge % of your damage, that while you refill concentration with hunting arrow and other skills.
    So it is not a matter of impossible, it is a matter of how.
    Players tend to look straight into a massive damage increase while they have so many options to do extremely high damage without the increased damage % from Q7
    Example that mec build will be doing 270% to 500% base damage semi permanently.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018
  13. trakilaki

    trakilaki Living Forum Legend

    You already have them in game. All classes are having a same pattern on weapons.
    All classes already have lower speed/higher damage 1H weapons ... exactly the same speed and exactly the same damage of a longbow.

    You are talking about ranger from dragonknight's point of view ... which is absurd.
    Ranger is no DK ... their game play is completely different.
    As I said before ... Royal Safety Net is a garbage.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2018
  14. Hetsunien

    Hetsunien Padavan

    Trakilaki's right. There's no sense in comparing any existing bow with Herald's set damage at boss killing. You can be a pretty strong 1H player shooting 5-6 Explosive Arrows at once (without refilling Concentration) and still don't deal more damage than a 70-60% (being generous) as if you trigger Q7 set only once.

    I like so much Bearach set and I can fire 3 explosive arrows and 1 scatter shot with my set up without refilling and still cannot do 40% damage of 1 burst of Herald's set.

    That's trully sad indeed... To become a robot of 2 skills net+explosive to be competitive in boss killing. This is why we need a 1H set that can compete with Q7 or another broken 2 hand set, nerf Q7 or buff other options.
     
    Arr likes this.
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