Feedback Release 174

Discussion in 'Discussions on Current Topics' started by Allogeneous, Sep 24, 2016.

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  1. ehrence8191

    ehrence8191 Forum Apprentice

    Q8 is absoutely amazing. It has a very eerie atmosphere and overall look is spot on. It reminded me of last years Christmas event, still get 1 hit by the headstones even with a decent armor and hp. The good thing about it is that you can shut it off by killing the 'mob' before crossing that area. Although I noticed, that some areas with headstones varies in attack speed? Some attack slower than others. Certain areas for example where the map boss resides, the headstones attacks faster although damage in that area is relatively lower than the areas where you can pre-shut it off it. It kills you overtime when you aren't careful especially with mobs also out to get you. The map is yes, long but that is exactly what the normal map is, so I think changing the map defeats what makes it 'parallel', around that region there isn't any map that is short anyway (normal world). There are some bugs, but the one most noticeable is the 2nd headstone boss, it gets sunken in, so you had to jump into its area to kill and get drops, jump out again when you are done. It is like it has a second floor or something. I find it funny and fun to do now, but i rather it gets fixed soon. Sigi's boss map is well a death trap I guess, at 1st it took me awhile to get the hang of it, the minions attack are not as strong as the clones in khalys that's for sure but when it gets too many with additional ice missiles that slows you down, it take its toll eventually. Although after 5 rounds, you will be able to get he's sequence of attack so you'll know what to do by then and how to go about, (that's strictly speaking painful mode). BTW, the latency indicator is BROKEN.
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2016
  2. sebastian_fl

    sebastian_fl Count Count

    Havee you done it?.. sure painful is very doable and soloable, but it is a chaos. But fatal is just a joke. So many flying objetcs, thunders, some balls, stones, sigi himself, his warriors etc... it is just zero fun. Zero. Of course our tank was having a relax time doing the same thing for 2-3 minutes, but the dps guys where just reviving each other from time to time. Your only strategy is to either go full dps, and die eventually (50% of runs at least once) or go defense mode and make those 2-3 minutes 10 minutes. Or use red. Buy red. There so many objects on the map that hits are unavoidable. Sure I got used to it a little bit, but you got eventually stuck anyway. So it is revive and kill, not something I would enjoy.

    I did 20 fatal runs, thats enough. It is just unenjoyable waste of resources with no benefit. It is way too much. Its not what I consider good and clever playability.
  3. _Baragain_

    _Baragain_ Living Forum Legend

    Just soloed it fatal, no deaths, on my first try... next? Video is uploading now.
  4. sebastian_fl

    sebastian_fl Count Count

    And whats your point? You are tank. As I said, tank doesnt care about all of that. Try it with DPS mage, on blue.
  5. _Baragain_

    _Baragain_ Living Forum Legend

    Not a tank... DPS. I couldn't tank for a team in the DPS build, and I can't take more than 3-4 of Sigris's direct hits (not a tank).

    I have discussed with other people who've done it in a team and the key is a manageable group size. Too big and it is too crazy. Too small and there won't be enough DPS. I'd say that the ideal Fatal group would be one DK with no more than 2xDPS class. That should make it easiest to control. The DK can hold the minions and then all the DPS classes need to do is stand in the right spot to avoid the missiles that are fired in straight lines, and outrun the very slow ice spheres. This boss is different than all the other bosses (except Khaly) because he is stationary in a small arena with more environmental threats than any other boss. It requires playing smarter and with a higher attention to one's surroundings than a normal boss, but it can be done. Fatal is supposed to be for the end gamers anyway, and this presents a new type of challenge for us. I'm very satisfied with this boss. I hope that when they do Gorga, that they will be just as innovative.

    P.S. A RA soloed it no deaths too... your arguments are invalid.
    Opalsion and Morinphen like this.
  6. Morinphen

    Morinphen Forum Overlooker

    After seeing a video of someone testing the Q8 tier 3 set, I can say that Ice Missile becomes quite the nice skill... but that requires one to farm, work around to fit it into a build and use the respective set, which altogether might be too much effort only to get something that's nice, but not really an auto-switch over the Magic Missile. So I'd neither put it as OP, nor as garbage - it used to be, now it has some potential, at least (even if it still didn't break the ice... ehehe...).

    sebastian_fl, I'm a mage too and quite frankly, you're probably bothering too much right now. Sure, not all sets will be equally good for all classes (heck, some aren't good for any... but then again, people's differents builds, luck and other factors are important in the equation as well), but I thought people dealt with that already (it adds diversity and uniqueness... it'd be boring if everyone had the same stuff and goals, etc.). I like the torso, but that's it... as said before, the two items + Ice Missile is a nice addition, but surely not an optimum one, I guess. Nevertheless, a step into the right direction... and I'm sure I don't have to stress how much we need those.

    As for the boss, after watching some videos, I can say it is indeed pretty well done. Will have to see how it treats me in-game, haha. Oh, also... nice video, Opalsion; admirable feat! Glad to see more proof to shove into the faces of those who say RAs are the worst class and all that BS :). Thank you :D.
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2016
    Opalsion and _Baragain_ like this.
  7. thouvou000

    thouvou000 Forum Expert

    well ok maybe i am more or less wrong about this but dont you agree that its a little too much to have thousand ice missiles shooting at players? and also yes in painful you can kill it one way or another but what happens on fatal? how many times u think that the dmg classes will die before killing this boss? or you say there is any way to survive in this chaos on fatal if you are not tank?
  8. bLaind

    bLaind Forum Baron

    The latency indicator needs a latency indicator :p... or just a shorter refresh rate.
    The new monsters (those yellow sparky dual wielders) from Q8M1 don't drop anything else except quest items, which by the way... those quest items can't be merged if you have some left used on the previous portal thingy, you'll have to complete the quest to get rid of those from your inventory.
    Those moving heads from PW Eternal Watch need a huge nerf, they do way too much damage.
  9. EhtovK

    EhtovK Old Hand

    I agree with most of what you said, but I'm gonna disagree with you on the fact that a RA soloing it invalids the arguments of a SW, our skills work in different ways and there's no way a SW can snipe Sigris from that distance and damage him effectively at the same time, the only option would be fireballs, and if I'm gonna fight with fireballs, trying to bash him in the head with my staff would be just as effective, Lightning strike nor Frozen Sphere have that range.

    And I'm not saying it's "impossible", I'm soloing him on painful just to try and learn tactics, but from my perspective, and after watching your video and Opalsion's, it appears to me that the SW is the one having the hardest time with this particular boss fight IF trying to solo, maybe I'll change my mind after getting the hang of it, but for now, that's my first impression.

    On another topic and as Sebastian pointed out, I would also like to hear an official statement on the missing +250 Critical hit rate on the set bonuses of SW items, is it a bug or is it intended?.


    Now, as added feedback, since I already gave my opinion on the boss fight:

    The maps are somewhat nice, although too big on my opinion, Eternal watch feels a bit empty at times but the graphics as always are flawless. I'm loving what you did with the scroll of provocation in the Eternal watch, almost gets me off guard.

    The changes to the ice missile are just "meh", if you don't have a full Q8 set (yes, I did the math), there's no one in its right mind switching from Magic missile to Ice missile.

    Cardhun is getting bigger and I love it, but I'd like to see more paths leading to the new areas, like making a central area around the travel stone and an octopus-like-ish design to lead to different areas, it's kinda annoying to run to the entrance of Q8, we're slowly getting it into a Kingshill like situation with the Event grounds, when this city is still in development and could prevent this issue from transforming into a big nuisance.

    The latency indicator is nice, but needs a lot of polishing to be actually useful. Another nice adition is the fixed behaviour of the cauldron in the New Moon event, props for that. Shop availability on respawn screen is..., "meh" again, I'd rather have chat availability.

    That'll be it for now, regards.
    Morinphen likes this.
  10. trakilaki

    trakilaki Living Forum Legend

    Changing your opinion? :D
    I did test it without the set ... i was clearing the entire Q8 with Ice Missile. And that is only the PVE aspect ... in PVP that skill is much more "useful".
    You know I always make 100% accurate feedback ... because i test everything before saying something. ;)
    You made a statement without even testing the features ... time will show ... like everything so far showed my avant-garde feedback was always accurate.

    As for Sigrismarr Frostclaw ... people forget that they need to get strong enough in order to encounter a boss. This new PW system spoiled them all. The old PW was much better in this aspect ... every next PW dungeon was harder than the previous one. Meaning the players must get stronger in order to play the next one. Now everyone thinks they are entitled to play all the PW maps ... well NO. You must get strong enough to be able to do that. Now every noob can jump on the bandwagon and farm the toughest maps. In the past that was a privilege only for the strongest.
    I did solo killed Sigrismarr both with SW and Ranger at fatal difficulty. With SW it was much easier ... because it suits my play style ... I don't use Frozen Sphere ;)
    _Baragain_ likes this.
  11. sebastian_fl

    sebastian_fl Count Count

    How can ones IMO be invalid? Thats just his own viewpoint of what he likes or dislikes.

    Guys, I havent said it is impossible. Perhaps you got me wrong. I said it is a joke and zero fun. We have done it as a team of 4 and 5, built a strategy with 2 dwarfs in one of the corners, and mage or mage+archer between second and theird statue in the center, so we can hit him with EA/Lighting and kill the statues as they activate. It does work. But.

    I can solo it fatal on red, perhaps. And make a video. It doesnt change the fact I do not like the boss.

    So now about but. As I said, there are way too many objects, unmanageble objects which you cannot intentionally avoid at a sustainable pace. Build a manageble strategy, which would sure require good concentration, prrcision and focus.

    Sustainable pace is a key here. Sure we can do a fight with no deaths. But can it be done 50 times in a row - hell no. With so many moving pieces and uncertainty in the center of the map, and every one of them is a 1 hit dead if you are in the dps mode. Also, I want to play it on blue, because this is my sustainable pace.

    So do I want the set? Yes, I do. Especially if they fix the lack of crit of the mage's set. But do I want to do a Sigi marathon? No exactly. Thats all I said.
  12. trakilaki

    trakilaki Living Forum Legend

    You will ... but it will take some time. Remember even Balor was taking red essences in the first try?
  13. sebastian_fl

    sebastian_fl Count Count

    Balor was too long. Sigi is low in terms oh hp. We did it on blue 20 times. The issue is not sigi himself, the issue is to kill minnions and statues fast enough until the whole map turns into a chaos. And also avoid the matrix/grid of missiles, thunders, balls, control minnions etc. That is what is harder on blue vs red.

    And in terms of dmg, I doubt anyone in my team lacked dmg. Im still on my journey to better staff and few otber things, but Im already more than enough to solo-fatal everything - 5k+ dmg, 80%crit, 350% cript dmg. And im not a complete glass canon too, 9k hp, over 50 resist and armor.
  14. trakilaki

    trakilaki Living Forum Legend

    You are missing the key point
    Meaning ... everything comes with practice. You can't do it now because you are not familiar with the boss and all the attacks ... yet.
  15. sebastian_fl

    sebastian_fl Count Count

    We will get better, yes, but this one is still way more random than the other. You cannot get used to randomness. And the players add another dimension of randomness, getting the minnion aggro from each other, tank losing aggro when stunned etc. I agree with you on 'practising', but I still dont enjoy the chaos and the map. Lets agree to disagree here. Im happy you like it, but my feedback is what it is. And all those solo-red videos are irrelevant to my case as they have nothing to do with a marathons at a sustainable pace, the only way I do bosses. Anyway :)
  16. SillySword

    SillySword Regular

    Today I try to do my level 50 DK's DQ, Kill worthy Bosses or World Bosses: 3 for 500 blue essences, it's different than before. Level 50 death knight boss in Q6M2 does not work, only level 45 Destructor counts. If it asks me to kill PW bosses three times, I don't think it's a good deal. I don't know whether it is changed, fixed or bug?

  17. sebastian_fl

    sebastian_fl Count Count

    So the mage's set will be fixed, and ice missile decreases the mana amount for 1 minute. Is it hard to write it down like that? Next shot and 1 minute are quite a difference.
    Morinphen likes this.
  18. Morinphen

    Morinphen Forum Overlooker

    Multiple examples from DPS classes have been mentioned and I guess there are even more out there, so it is possible (talking about not dying during a boss fight, not necessarily solo-beating it). Yes, it is harder than most (if not all) bosses to stay alive in this new Q8, but with some careful analysis and some "nimble feet", DPS classes should be able to find a way not to die all the time there. After completing it, I can say that it's indeed frustrating, but not impossible... so just hang in there and try to find a sweet spot xD. As it's been discussed here, practice makes perfect (as with mostly anything), but one can't deny that it's harder to get good at one thing over another... this is an example of something harder to master.
    Regarding the Shock Units... similar to the cannonballs in Q7... if one uses theirs to advance the quest, all others can progress too, but only the one who clicked no longer has them in the inventory. I saw they fixed this in Q3, so that all of the players need to use their Amber Runes and open their portals in order to advance, so I suspect they will come 'round to these newer Qs as well... or at least I hope so. They should make them disappear once their purpose has been fulfilled.

    As for the heads... well, except the last two sections (last Frostbringer & the Pale Enforcer) you can't get hit if you go the common-sense way and first go and kill the Frostbringer to deactivate those irritating things (that they just had to add in a PW... as if they didn't get enough hate from the winter event already xD), but I agree with you because the closer you get to the boss room, the more chances you have to get hit, since the last Frostbringer and the last mini-lieutenant-boss are not on a safe path from the cannons, as are the first Frostbringers, so in those areas the damage from those missiles isn't ignorable for most (even more so if you have mobs pestering you and your allies).
    Not changed, just altered a bit. As said, with the set, it would be mildly on par with MM... without... why? 65% over 100% with mana regen. ? IDK why you like it so much, but whatever rows your boat, I guess xD. As for PvP... the very few times I got opponents using it, it was indeed annoying, so even more so now, even even more if someone has the set xD... but most of those times I won, and since I'm no pro-PvP-er, that says something xD. All in all, again, I see the skill improved and with a boosted potential in the form of that set, but given everything, I'd still not use it over MM.

    You don't use FS ? LS, then? Fireball xD ? To be honest, I'd be curious to see the full details of TheChosenOne's build.
    Well, this I do agree with.
    None of the above. For that challenge you can do the following: Destructor, Nefertari (not sure on this one, but think it'd count), Balor and PW bosses (Grimmag, Arachna, Heredur, Bearach, Khalys, Mortis, Herald, Sigri) - not mini-bosses, as the one you mentioned. However, if you go Q1, you can see that the smaller Grimmags you have to beat in map 2 count, so that's probably the best and fastest way to do the said challenge (and the only somewhat of an exception in this case).
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2016
  19. bLaind

    bLaind Forum Baron

    He never counted to me. But it counts the DKs from Q6M2 (the ones that drop mortis coins), and the stationary Grimmags from Q1M2.
  20. Morinphen

    Morinphen Forum Overlooker

    Wait, he said "Q6M2"... so does he mean Q6 M1 knight, or M2 ones? Didn't know the coin-knights from M2 counted as worthy/world bosses.
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