Feedback Release 220

Discussion in 'Discussions on Current Topics' started by teddy.bear, Jun 28, 2019.

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  1. heror

    heror Forum Baron

    alsmost noone needs magothina tho....
    Karabossa takes neutral dmg at best.
    so if u make the calculations correctly . SW is not better than dwarf, ever. Sm turrets allone outdmg SW.
    Heck a 45k dmg dwarf = 63k dmg sw.fair right ?
  2. Tilwin90

    Tilwin90 Padavan

    As I was sharing from my personal experience, I have more problems with Magothina than Karabossa. I'm no endgame character yet; I still have to get the blue recipe and still lack Dragan set, plus my Q7 is sitting only at 36% base damage (and I got and refined quite a few in an attempt to get a better one). So I am also blaming it on my character, not on the SW being less powerful. Heck, I hate playing as a SM due to the lack of tanking possibilities.

    Yes, I am aware that an endgame SM does the most damage nowadays, but it's mainly because of the power of the Q7+Q8 set that is super potent and actually allows the turrets to hit without requiring good positioning. If a Mechanicus were to use the mechanical turrent against either of them, without tanking options I'd like to see them maximize their damage (then again, I've seen the oil is super potent against both the spider queens now so I can be easily contradicted).

    Ultimately I dislike the "class X is OP" direction of the discussion especially when we talk about PVE. Rather than debating that the SM is OP, let's see how we can get this ridiculous release balanced, especially in terms of boss fights (I'm especially looking here at the DK who seem to have been impacted the most by R220)

    And why I want Magothina? For the adornment of course. Contrary to dwarves and rangers who enjoy using the Q8 set, I find less and less mages use it, and I personally don't like it that much myself. Right now I have the Karabossa adornment, but the 5% mana does not look that good on paper when compared to the extra damage.
  3. ΣMiwel

    ΣMiwel Forum Ambassador

    I don't really remember... and can't check it anymore... but I think that something was messed up about the elemental affinity of the New Moon bosses. Perhaps it was something like Karabossa - poison and Magotina - ice? Or maybe it was only in DtU... or maybe I am mistaken completly.
    45k dmg dwarf < 63k dmg sw when both are full leg
    45k dmg q7+q8 dwarf > 63k dmg sw (with any sets)
    Maybe because their elemental affinity is messed up... or maybe you can't use your skills. I'm dead serious here. Read on.
    If you have the royal gems to look for that recipe...
    This is the endgame.
    So you're not 60k dmg, but maybe 25k or 30k. So what? You can compare yourself to a 20k q7+q8 dwarf.
    If you want tanking possibilities, why didn't you go for a DK?
    In all due seriousness, if SM lacks "tanking possibilities", I simply don't know what to say.
    Iron Dwarf: Am I a joke to you?
    Dwarf in a Box: Am I a joke to you?
    It's super effective!
    That is not the biggest problem. The problem is, it multiplies the damage of the strongest turret against bosses by 3 and allows spamming of the strongest standalone damage skill on top of the constant buff that makes you hit on green ess like you normally would on purple!
    Sometimes you have to say the truth in the simpliest possible words that are going to be understood by everyone. If I now said that dwarfs have an overpowered set combination that increases their damage output at least threefold compared to the other options and classes, how many people would understand me properly, how many people would even care to understand that?
    In other words, "class X is OP" is simply an attention attractor.
    SM is not OP. Classes are actually pretty much balanced in PvE without those damned sets. One problem are the sets (that are the cause for imbalance between the classes on the high end), and the second one is that usually the meta build pretty much outclasses all the other ones and so there is little to no diversity inside each specific class. The problem with this release is that the game is based upon broken economy of fast runs. Making the runs slower only annoys people and makes progress slower, at times impossible. Economy was unfair until now. Since R220 it's even more unfair and broken.
    Solution to the first problem is a rebalancing of the Q7 and Q8 sets between classes.
    Special effects have to be removed from the Q7 buff for ranger, dwarf and DK. That means no more EA spam/HS spam/quicker smashes during the buff.
    Meanwhile, to the ranger Q7 set an all-time 25 concentration flat cost reduction of EA has to be added. This means that EAs cost less, are easier to be spammed and buff independent... but the buff is not broken... or soon will no longer be.
    To the dwarf Q7 set, a 50% reduction of the heavy shot cooldown could be applied.
    To the DK Q7 set, a 50% rage cost reduction of Smash could be applied.
    Then, the buff has to be made 7 seconds for every class... but with a cooldown of 20 seconds. Of course, all of these numbers could be changed later if it was needed.
    Regarding Q8 set, its "triple bolts" effect for dwarf should be removed, instead it should increase the Mechanical Turret damage by 20% (the multiplier SW has on his set) and it's shots should explode after hitting an enemy, dealing their damage in a small AoE.
    Then, the lightning from the ranger's and DK's versions should crit.
    These should be enough to balance the things out.
    The second problem could be solved by buffing some of the other sets, adding new uniques (especially 1h) and through an exp skilltree overhaul. I don't thing they are going to make it the way I'd feel it should be done, but almost everyone is using the same skills as of now, the tree is not very complex, not very interesting, there are not that many skills, not that many talents, only one points is added per level, etc.
    The last problem, which is the economy, requires a choice: in which direction should the game go?
    Now, the best way in my opinion? I think that there are three major points that should be changed about the game economy:
    1. Crafting should be way less item-hungry. This could be done by making the "revert" option return all the four items.
    2. The drop rate of the most important uniques (eg. PW boss sets) has to be visibly higher, currently it is unreasonably low.
    3. Unique (platinum) lines must have a slightly higher appearance rate.
    If they want to go for the fast-runs economy (as it has been until now), they would have to nerf the mobs again. If they want to change the economy, but don't want to change anything about crafting, they should increase the platinum and golden lines drop rates or make the bosses drop additional large stacks of "extraordinary equipment" (the openable random item, just like the ones from the fullmoon progress bar). Either way, the drop rate of the most important uniques has to be higher.
    Not as much as it would look like. Every release... R185, R209, R214, some others... every single bigger release DKs feel so impacted, nerfed, destroyed. Many of them left after each of those releases. What happened to those that didn't leave? It always turned out they only became even stronger. Sometimes it requires farming up a little bit of resources and buying a single item (r185), sometimes more skillful gameplay (r209) or even nothing really at all (r214).
    Then... why don't you use a guardian on the other side of her and singu centered on her, standing yourself on the edge of singu? You can do it with her, you can't do it that easily with Karabossa (since the latter is dropping meteors with large explosions that force you out.
    Rangers? Since when? Q8 set for rangers is as off-meta as it could be. Torso is the best choice (on pair with Q1 maybe), yes. Whole set - not necessarily.
    Less and less? Who are you asking? :p It's the strongest option, since the buff can now be stacked on bosses.
    That's enough of an excuse not to use it. Mages luckily have the smallest gap between the meta and the secondary build options.
    5% mana is nothing, really. However, so far it looks like the future* are the more special effects (like those of PW sets) rather than regular state increases.
    * - if there is one
    Bundin and sargon234 like this.
  4. Purgerzg

    Purgerzg Active Author

    You are so focused on dwarfs and you don't know basic of dwarf game play

    You can not say this class is OP because you need to test PW from q1 to q9 (full,ofc); all events, scaled dungeons.....and then you see if some class have some great advantage or not (you know if we have 4 classes some of class are always gone be 1. and some always will be 4., impossible to change that), I deliberately skipped pvp

    Developers can play in "god mode" so they can test your false theory or any other theory (but developers are in secret society who is only purpose to nerf all classes except dwarf class)

    So let me teach you something, with r220 bosses have increase minion spawn number and shorten time for spawn minions (super for SW,they can MC all the time and FS/lightning deal same dmg),
    well for dwarfs with q8 set not that good, turrets attack minions and need to spend rocket + HS spam on minions while boss receive 0 dmg,
    ofc all the time need to watch where to put turrets (hard to play with destroyable attacks skills) and running in limited area
    and in clearing map, SW hit pack of 10 monsters they deal 3500% dmg to them (not included 60% of FS going through them) well dwarf just put turrets who didn't even shot one

    And for bizarre theory about 45k dwarf is more then 60k SW; dwarf with 50-60k dmg (q7+q8 set) clear q1 inf3 (boss on blue ess) in 12-13min,so SW with same stats need 20min?

    And about buffs, SW have double dmg (not % on this item or % damage, but double) with +100 mana, dwarf have around 20% (DK have 0%, but I skipped comparison for other classes, only compare SW and SM)

    And in TS I play with SW (9-11k dmg,16k critic,45k HP;q4+q8 set) q1 inf3 only m1,
    it take me around 20min but I can do it with rare death,
    with dwarf super hard and often death (same stats and q7+q8)

    And again my proposal to all of you who play on grimmag server, you can join me and we test all of that theory (ofc you need to be strong enough to kill solo boss on inf3)
  5. trakilaki

    trakilaki Living Forum Legend

    I am so sad for poor midgets.
    Maybe you should try my 1H 20K base damage ranger so you would feel OP.
    Mind you though ... scientists may find a way to manipulate the fabric of time and space sooner rather than you finishing a run.
    Purgerzg likes this.
  6. Novadude

    Novadude Commander of the Forum

    From what i can tell, playing all 4 types (lv 55 dk and mech on agathon, level 55 ranger and 46 sw on test server), it looks like mechs should be having the easiest time in the post R220 world.

    My ts sw is not endgame and my ranger is stuck in upgrade hell, trapped with 10K max damage and no real way to get better now that inf I is rougher.

    That being said, 2H turret and run is a viable strategy for weak mechs and the other character types do not have anything comparable strategy wise for generating usable gear in a quick time frame.

    An especially optimal strategy for turret and run mechs is to just farm the green permanent shadaqians (or whatevertheyre called) on inf I-III on the western edge of Great Desert, one at a time, drawing them into turrets placed into the corridors to temple of agony entrance.
  7. Purgerzg

    Purgerzg Active Author

    Not good strategy,you need to kill mini bosses on inf3 for some OK items.
    With SW use Mind control/Frost wind/robot and singularity on yorself; monsters do not attack you.
    With SM turrets are like popcorn,better are tesla and praying that they will stunt
    I do not play RA
    And with DK is easiest,what ever I do, I am dead in first 5 sec
    I personaly skipp melee mini bosses with poison/fire

    All of this are showing nothing because I have characters with low stats on TS
  8. Αtsalak0t0s

    Αtsalak0t0s Forum Inhabitant

    You blow our minds .. 20k one hand bow ? Really , you farm like this
    The best mode you farm is inf1?
  9. Akageshi

    Akageshi Forum Duke

    He has a bow with break critical damage limit.
    Purgerzg likes this.
  10. MaxDisappointed

    MaxDisappointed Forum Master

    Any decent 2h player have full crit dmg and full crit rate.
  11. Frostarch

    Frostarch Junior Expert

    Am i the only one who seems to love the removal of boss shops? I think i want to come back and play..

    Edit: this is for all bosses, paraller world ones too right?
  12. sargon234

    sargon234 Commander of the Forum

    that's because you're a BP shill but there are others, don't worry
  13. Frostarch

    Frostarch Junior Expert

    I literally quit the game because there wasn't enough fun rng and i hated collecting coins to buy gears. YOu can see this in my post history if you're not lazy. And now they saying they want to bring back the fun in loot...

    Do you not see they are trying to fix the main reason i quit for?
  14. MaxDisappointed

    MaxDisappointed Forum Master

    There are many people who think that the fun and beautiful part of the game is to see that the item you wanted finally got dropped, farm coins to buy it is not the same joy as to see the yellow flash on the ground.
    And although some do not want to see it, the drop has been considerably increased, there are simply more valuable items which are logically more rare to drop.
    And the game is easy, you don't even need to drop an item on high tier, you can use cores to augment it.
    1vanka and aBDuLHaMiTHaN like this.
  15. edrogers58

    edrogers58 Regular

    Question Post 220
    Are the developers working yet to merge all remaining players onto 1 server ? If they are not they best make it snappy !!!!
    One of the best Knights on Agathon server quit and deleted all his 4 toons I have been told. (Baragain if this is not true please correct me)
    Other people I have talked to since I been back from work,which is only 2 days, have said they are playing maybe 5 hours a week where they used to play 8-10 hours a day!! And,before any of you trolls of the forum start, it is not RL commitments it is because they are bored and disappointed in the direction the game is going .
    I am glad I have played Drakensang for 6 maybe 7 years now, to be honest if I found this game now I would not last a week.
    You used to be able to build a character without spending a cent.
    I have noticed now that Gem drops are rare as are Ander drops.
    Yes you have raised Unique drops but they are Durian and Yakkak Roshan Keen not the decent Uniques people want .
    Maybe one of your development team can say why you are doing this, I have my views.
    You are being greedy,but your greed is working against you. People that used to buy Premium are stopping, the hard core PVP gamers that bought Andermant to buy Gems for PVP, where are they now ???
    Your long term players are leaving there is exodus after exodus.
    A lot of people are sick of building a character to watch you nerf it,every 6 months or year.
    Games are supposed to be fun not a chore.
    It is easy for me to walk away from Drakensang I never gave you a cent over the years.
    Thanks for what was once a fun game that is now something about to disappear,so many people have given you ideas in so many different forums,the majority of these have been blown off for things no one wants or needs.
    1vanka likes this.
  16. kavekanis

    kavekanis Forum Apprentice

    update 220 one more that contributes to the disappearance of players, said that I will give my opinion of the game and its current status.

    It seems that everyone talks about a corpse that nobody dares to say has died. come on ... is not the evidence enough? the game will never be what it was in its early years,

    the lack of investment, the lack of creativity, the lack of motivation to lift it make that not possible.

    the old players either have left the game or are in a zombie state doing the same thing again and again or just making the zombie in citys, the new ones are only temporary until 9 out of 10 leave and the number 10 will leave too, the veterans of the forum continue to contribute great ideas and solutions for nothing and the moderators are still doing his work as towards the titanic orchestra,

    the game is dead. accept it. A miracle will not happen, there will not be a group of veterans of the game or forum that team up with the developers to resurrect it, there will be no company that comes to save it, nor will the German development team return. just look at your list of old friends or activity of your veteran clan .... walkingdead

    drakensang requiem in pace 2011-2020. yes like a mague i can see the future :)

    a tribute from here to baragain, one of those veterans who would have helped save this game and being smart as is the best decision

    DeaDFingerS (now only DEADACC)
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2019
    aBDuLHaMiTHaN likes this.
  17. sargon234

    sargon234 Commander of the Forum

    guess what, liar, the unique drop hasn't increased, at least on the uniques that matter

    Farming coin to buy uniques was a baindaid to disguise a horrendous problem of the game: bad unique drop rates, which should be massively increased and not just on trash sets that aren't useful
    Because, maybe you haven't realized, but they don't have fixed values, but they have random values
    So on top of having to drop them, you have to get them with the right values

    That model, of low unique drop rates, which was beyond crap, had a point in existing back then uniques had fixed values and actually were powerful items

    besides, this model is the most antimeritocratic system it could ever be conceived, as it rewards luck and not farming
    and it lead to situation like a noob dropping the unique on the first time and then someone which farms daily not getting it after 1000s of runs
    And it's very funny that the shills and the useful EDIT like you were complaining about noobs getting carried and then buying the unique but weren't complaining about the very same system which rewarded noobs even more for getting carried: at least when there was a trader the noobs actually had to farm to buy the items

    But you're the very same guy that defended the great theft of sapphires and claimed( apparently with a straight face) that more endgame builds don't make the game more diverse
    I remember you being a noob BP shill who didn't know about the game

    There's no fun RNG if the drop rates are bad
    That's what they are saying: but their words have no value, they lied multiple times and everytime they claimed something like that they made the game worse, as they did in R220 for example
    They haven't brought fun in loot, however they brought great boredom in playing
    well yes, the game doesn't have much time left
    Last edited by moderator: Jul 29, 2019
  18. Mal3ficent

    Mal3ficent Guest

    Off topic posts and belligerent rants will be immediately removed from now on.

    Shine2 likes this.
  19. Αtsalak0t0s

    Αtsalak0t0s Forum Inhabitant

    Almost every day i have one player in my friend list who have delete his charachter
    Today he has delete his ranger one player who play seems i know my self in this game .... Seiously this game in every Release die and more hard ...
    The truth in my friend list is all is active but only for take the daily and then fast my friendlist is offline all day exept 2-3 players who play every day...
    The game have no more fun , pve is destroyed, pvp destryed ...event is as usual the same with some changes ...
  20. Phyrix

    Phyrix Count Count

    I dont know what to say about R220 as a dk
    I still play dso
    I dont understand how a Q4 dk cannot solo grimm on fatal, but it is something I have to accept I guess.
    I can only hope to land 3x dragan pieces from dtu.
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