board of players

Discussion in 'Creative Corner' started by kavekanis, Aug 10, 2018.

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will help save this game?

  1. yes

    12 vote(s)
  2. no

    1 vote(s)
  1. kavekanis

    kavekanis Forum Apprentice

    best regards. my proposal is to create a board of players with proven experience in the game and the forum that works with the developers to try to save this game. that at least 5-6 players are heard I think it would be enoughI think that developers need the help of people who really love this game, know it thoroughly and know the wishes of the community,
    I am sure that the developers try to do the best for the game and for the company to get benefits and attract more players but it is evident that the developers do not live the day to day of the game. they fix the mechanics of the game but they do not know their spirit. the one that was lost many years ago. they try to correct inequalities but the game in its essence does not improve and little by little it seems abandoned to its fate.
    it's like a car the mechanics will fix their engine but it is the one who drives it who knows it, in this case the driver is the one who plays it
    with a great product in their hands everything seems to be worse, the events and desires that people demand are forgotten
    This advice could be chosen by moderators or developers. I think there are very valid people in this forum or the German who could save this game with their ideas and make that big point had more benefits with the help of this players

    in other games this board of players exists and I think it is beneficial for all
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2018
  2. KingKrazy1

    KingKrazy1 Active Author

    Yes, and yes again. More that simply help guide the decisions of the devs, this board could act as a team of community managers explaining to the players why different decisions and aspects of the game are made. That is, the communication would go both from the players to the devs and from the devs to the players.
    pisy37 likes this.
  3. MademoiselleCaramel

    MademoiselleCaramel Junior Expert

    Trakilaki for president ofc.
  4. silverseas

    silverseas Count Count

    How will the members of the board be determined? Do we have elections? Are they nominated? Appointed? Volunteers? Voluntold? What about representation of the different servers? How about representation of different language forums (some of which have ceased to exist too)? What if members of the board have literally opposing ideas? Who gets the final say?
    trakilaki and _Baragain_ like this.
  5. _Baragain_

    _Baragain_ Living Forum Legend

    That sounds a lot like the moderators... except the other people on the forum give them crap when they try to do this, so what makes you think that it would be any better if it was just another bunch of players? I refer you to the mod application post:

    So, mods have to be expert players who help people and are fair (seeing both sides of the issue). And in return, they represent BP here on the forums and offer help/advice while also participating in pushing new ideas for the Dev team... sounds like your "Board of Players" is our local moderator team, they just happen to be anonymous with respect to who they are in the game.

    Can I be VP? :p:D
    trakilaki likes this.
  6. MademoiselleCaramel

    MademoiselleCaramel Junior Expert

    Heey, who else for VP? :D

    I am writing as a regular player who do not take much seriously game, for me is not bussiness, it is just a place to have fun, also I am not smart for game design and mechanic.

    Mods became too official, too cold, one cannot sympathize/identify (sry I am not sure what would be the right word) with them. I like transparency. Players need someone who can trust and equate with.

    Trakilaki and Baragain. Two names that stand out on forum, two personas who know the game, know the players, who are intelligent, cold headed, see bigger picture and fuuuuunny (game is no fun anymore, even forum is no fun, only here and there you can see a bright light of traki's humor).

    I know couple of more names from Grimmag server who could be nice addition to that board of quality representative players. Quality as a whole "package", not OP stats, and players who do care about game design overall and see bigger picture. Not some greedy player who wants all the best only for himself, and not just that, all others must have all the worst, so he can be even more "great".

    I have a constant feeling that the game is dying. Quality gamers gave up, cuz tbh, it takes a ton of nerves and stuborness to be still here.

    All the time I search and look for new rpg's and other games. DSO really do stand out, and I like it, but lately, with each event, more and more negative than positive stuff I see. Sometimes I feel bad for all the negative feedback, cuz those devs who make all this probably do not feel nice to hear that. But I have no idea what are they doing and why they are destroying the game and all the fun.

    That is why I vote "yes" for this kind of suggestion, cuz maaaaybe this could save the game.
    trakilaki and KingKrazy1 like this.
  7. Akageshi

    Akageshi Forum Duke

    I'm sure only elite players would make it to the "board". Logical - they have experience. But elite players don't think in terms of weak or mid players. They are in a bubble of top tiers, top farming, top power. Look at the forum: Everyone's always only arguing from their own viewpoint, ignoring problems of players on different levels of power and experience and especially luck. It's natural, I probably do it too unintentionally despite not being top, but unless there are truly objective members of your board of players, I don't like the idea too much. ... Not that my opinion matters.
    trakilaki likes this.
  8. heror

    heror Forum Baron

    Depends A top player doesnt always know all of the things. Last month i was explaining an endgamer how mages spells work with q8 so that doesnt always work.
    In my opinon players who play since a long time ago with proven knowledge

    Except Baragain and Traki in my -8 years experience with this game i havent seen anyone else who is worthy of this place
    trakilaki likes this.
  9. kavekanis

    kavekanis Forum Apprentice

    [QUOTEHow will the members of the board be determined? Do we have elections? Are they nominated? Appointed? Volunteers? Voluntold? What about representation of the different servers? How about representation of different language forums (some of which have ceased to exist too)? What if members of the board have literally opposing ideas? Who gets the final say? ][/QUOTE]

    members of the boards can be determined by the moderators or in a vote by players. the representation of different servers is indifferent since what serves for one will serve for all, with respect to the forums at this moment the only forums with activity are English and German, besides it has to be thought that the communication with the big team point would have to be in one of these two languages

    if it could be said that this function would have to be fulfilled by the moderators but it is evident that it is not enough or they are not listened to, I do not know if the moderators are experienced players or if they are listened to. If your job is more to keep calm than to convey the wishes of the community, or if it is too much work to convey the ideas and suggestions of all the players. that's why I think that with 5 or 6 players that we all respect their opinion would be a great help to improve the game. maybe they are anonymous give enough confidence but I can understand who prefer to be

    totally agree
    some of those elite players are concerned about all aspects of the game not only yours in this forum and the German there are clear examples of it, they are truly the elite of the game although few exist and I think only they can save this game
    people like baragain, trakilaki, ultrapeinch of the german forum I think are recognized and respected by everyone I would say many more names of this forum or the german but humbly I do not think that I should be the one to give names of these 3 because I recognize their contributions work and hundreds of lost hours to answer all of us,

    just playing well the game is not enough to be a member of a players' council, obviously you have to know the game thoroughly but it is more important to know and have ideas to solve what is fudging in the game at all levels than being a top killer, and if there are very few that see with those skills maybe as I say 5 or 6
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2018
    trakilaki likes this.
  10. Phyrix

    Phyrix Count Count

    Personally I think that it would make all of the players more biast than it already is.
    If one were to do this you would need a leader rep for every class on every server and a leader that represents the class.
    Iow there would not only be traki or dr horrible
    In other words dr horrble would be the main representative for dragon knights however he will be taking feedback from the top and most experienced dragon knights on all the servers.
    Traki on rangers ofc and so the list goes.
    The politics of this however will create factions that lean towards for and against something
    If you think the classes rip at each other now you would see another thing coming
    You know how the dev team gets scrutinized for taking so long with gem crafting, well they are busy with a non level 60 content expansion too.
    While doing that they are busy rebalancing the game and they are working on PW uniques and ofcourse Q10 in pw
    All this while they are busy working on events and reworking older events
    quoted that they are reworking new moon and full moon too
    Do you really think the dev team will now suddenly listen to the public reps whines about their class?
    It would be absurd nothing would ever get done.
    Do you know how many times I mailed the dev team in the past year alone?
    First mail was regarding the limited amount of uniques
    3 weeks later came the update with all the reworked uniques.
    After that mailed them about my dissappointment in the premium weapon that it needs a damage unique line, be that weapon damage or increased damage (30 to 50%)
    Also told them that the 30% lightning strike for mages was too much of a nerf since the bearach set increases it as much as it does they should at least have kept it at 100% like it was on ts before
    I have repeatedly mailed them regarding weapons and 1 hand builds being seen as useless
    So I am sure they get a lot of feedback and that I am not the only one mailing them
    trakilaki likes this.
  11. KingKrazy1

    KingKrazy1 Active Author

    It sucks that the moderators get crap. I dont think thats fair, obviously.
    On the other hand, please point me to where the moderators explained the All for None event. I want to know why the devs are making the decisions they do, and the mods either don't have this information or are choosing not to give it.

    EDIT: teddy.bear just posted some answered questions about R212. This is the sort of thing I want. Of course I will always ask for more communication even if they write a whole book of it, but I also can't say they aren't doing something when they obviously are.
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
    trakilaki likes this.
  12. Mal3ficent

    Mal3ficent Guest

    Hello @Phyrix ,
    Support officers are part of the Moderation Team.
    You were mailing the Moderation Team. :)
    Moderation team is collecting feedback and sending the feedback to the higher-ups.

  13. Phyrix

    Phyrix Count Count

    Thx for that now I know at least :D
  14. _Baragain_

    _Baragain_ Living Forum Legend

    There have been some. The fist one that comes to mind is BigPapa. To this day, he still has the third most "liked" posts on the English forums (and more likes than he has total posts at that), and that is even after not having been online for over two years. The day he left was one of the biggest losses to this community in the last several years.
    trakilaki likes this.
  15. heror

    heror Forum Baron

    Well i actively started to write in this forum since a year and a half ago so i sadly didnt see him ;-;. hope we find more ppl like him.
    Altough i still dont think likes are the things that matter. I have seen plenty of times how good criticism isnt well accepted because ppl dont like when they dont get smt.
  16. _Baragain_

    _Baragain_ Living Forum Legend

    True. I simply mentioned it because it reflects the kind of guy he was. He was well liked, respected, level headed, fair... I could go on, but he was one of the best community members we've ever had. He had a way of even making criticism sound less harsh and didn't have the same biting/sharp nature that Trakilaki and I have when dealing with people who type first and think second. I honestly miss the guy a ton.
    Dragonnns likes this.
  17. If I may, I'll step in here and offer a Mod's perspective on some of these points and give you a small look behind the curtain.

    I assure you, while we may be cold and official with our official presences, we are not like that behind the scenes. Our moderator accounts are our official connection with you, the players. That official presence requires a certain amount of detachment and professionalism since we are not here to be anyone's friends, but rather we are here to enforce the rules and play the middleman between the players and the DSO team. We are volunteers and perform these duties out of a love for the game. We do have a side that you don't see. For example, we have our own little chat room where we discuss issues, debate ideas, and just "hang out." But outside of that room, we are all business.

    Another detail that you are probably not aware of (because of how restrained we are on the forums) is that we are very passionate about this game and regularly go to bat for the players. More than once, members of the Mod Team have butted heads with our "bosses" at BigPoint because we tell them things they don't like to hear. You only see our official side where we offer tech support, answer basic questions, and enforce the rules when someone steps out of line. But never forget, as we are also players, we have our "Social Accounts" too. Those are the ones where we participate with this community as invested players who have hopes and dreams of our own for this game. You may not connect the dots and know who is who, but I assure you, all the mods on the team are also active in the community as players too... It's part of the requirements to be a mod after all.

    Not all the members of the team are "elites." Some of us just enjoy playing more casually while others are more "elite" in how they approach this game. However, we do have representation of every class on the team and we are all well acquainted with the mechanics. Because of the diversity, we often debate the ideas relating to balance, and I think that our debates are probably the most objective debates on the topic possible, especially when compared to the "My class is so weak" or "Nerf this OP class" thread that are constantly showing up on the forums. Again, you may not see it, but a lot goes on behind the scenes to support and fight for this community.
    Well, we are experienced, but you'll have to take my word on that. But, as we are not employees, we don't have any real say in what happens. We are just the people who collect, process, and pass on valid feedback on a weekly basis. If the team chooses not to listen to what we pass on, what makes you think that they'd actually use the feedback from this hypothetical Board of Players? I can tell you, after reading this thread, what you are looking for already exists in the form of the Moderator teams. While I can't speak for the other language teams, I know that the English team is a dedicated group of players that care deeply about this game and it's future and will never stop fighting on the player's behalf. You may never see it, but it does happen.

    Perhaps, as a kid, you heard the phrase "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all." If we moderators don't like something, we aren't going to complain to you, the players. Nor are we going to try to defend something that we don't agree with. Instead, we take your negative feedback, combine it with any feedback we have, and push it up. It's happened before, and I'm sure it will happen again.

    Finally, I'd like to end by reminding you all that anyone can apply to be a moderator. If you are an active part of this community and think you can offer even more as a moderator, please, apply. Many times, we've had new mods join the team who ended up shocked by just how much goes on behind the scenes and that the world is more complicated than it seems, but don't let that discourage you. If you want to help make a difference, I challenge you to join the team and help us improve the game for everyone.
    Veηom, -HARRA81-, Sunlight and 10 others like this.
  18. KingKrazy1

    KingKrazy1 Active Author

    @YouWinOrYouDie Thank you so much for the explanation. Given the current state of the game, I don't envy your position, and wish you the best as you continue to be pulled and pushed by both the players and devs.

    In this case, I guess instead of a board of players, we need more direct explanation from the devs themselves. You mods shouldn't be forced to look at all the backlash and never get to share great news with us.
    Yogo likes this.
  19. trakilaki

    trakilaki Living Forum Legend

    I support any kind of discussion even negotiation between the players and the game.
    However ... even if i am very violent in nature ... i do not support coup d'état.
    But it is already that way ... the mods are players.

    Cooperation between developers and players/community is not a taboo.
    I was a part of a gaming community (without any significant role though) when we had prefect communication and cooperation with the dev team (a German team BTW) of another game.
    (to mods: the game and the company are not BP's rivals in any way :) )
    Pokemon Online!!!

    I will have to turn down your offer and leave the presidency to Baragain :D

    I already have a lot of things to do at DSO Wiki and i can't even make them done alone. I don't need another waste of time ... but thanks for your trust :p
    Players can't be segregated into Elite and peasants .
    There are different players in the game based on their human qualities:
    - generous and stingy
    - good and bad
    - knowledgeable and noobs
    - new and old
  20. Iselda

    Iselda Advanced

    The idea is quite good, however finding open-minded ppl that will speak for all sort of players (see last part of Traki's post) and classes would be difficult. There are too many egoists that care only for their own class and demand nerf for others.

    [I'm not talking about EN team here] BP has no idea what sort of ppl represent them on language fora. If they had, there would be no BAs allowing ex-mods to spread hate for weaker players and make fun of them on forum, no mods that discourage and kill the player's need to express themselves on fora, no support officers leaking private information to those that should not have such information and so on. I know it's not a place to discuss such matters. BP's just not aware of it and keeps loosing players.

    I'm happy that the EN team is neutral <3 and knows perfectly well what moderation and help means :)
    _Baragain_ likes this.